Podcast Episode 418: Motherhood, Mindset, and Messy Self-Talk: Getting Real Transcripts

Please note: Transcripts for the No Guilt Mom Podcast were created using AI. As a result, there may be some minor errors.

JoAnn Crohn (00:00)

Welcome to the No Guilt Mom podcast. I’m your host JoAnn Crone, joined here by the brilliant Brie Tucker.

Brie Tucker (00:07)

Hello everybody how are you?

JoAnn Crohn (00:09)

I am super excited for our guest today, She has written a new children’s book that we were just talking beforehand and the children’s book like made me tear up at the end and it made me cry 

JoAnn Crohn (00:24)

It’s funny because I think that you and I both we talk about being in this stage of our life, like I’m approaching perimenopause and you’re there and like I know that my emotions will go up and down and up and down a lot. Even more so I feel like than when I was in pregnancy stages. ⁓ hell yeah. Yeah. So when you like hear a touching story and it affects you so hard. So I’m really excited to get into this. We’re going to be talking about all things motherhood. We’re going to be talking about her new book, but let me introduce who we have with us today. It is Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt. She is a New York Times bestselling author, mother and host of the podcast BDA Baby.

A passionate animal advocate, Katherine works as an ambassador for Best Friends Animal Society and the ASPCA. She is a global ambassador for the Special Olympics and she lives with her family in Los Angeles. She also has a new children’s book releasing today, Kat and Brandy that you should rush out today. Bye right now. And let’s get on with the show.

Welcome to the podcast, Katherine. We’re so happy to have you here.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (01:30)

Thank you so much. you for having me.

JoAnn Crohn (01:32)

You have like this wonderful window behind you with like such like sunny weather and like looks out on trees. And I have to say I’m a little jealous because I’m here in my basement and looked like a window well and it looks so pretty where you are.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (01:46)

I mean, that’s nice, but it’s actually raining. So I’m glad that you think that it looks so pretty because it’s like a stormy day here. 

Brie Tucker (01:55)

It’s a stormy day here in Phoenix as well. JoAnn and I were talking about the light and I’m like, you’re in your little basement dungeon and you’re having issues with the light and I’m here, my first floor, I have four windows and they all are dark because it’s just dark. We never get rain in Phoenix that often. and I don’t think-

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (02:12)

We don’t get it much in LA, but it’s definitely like a humid, it’s like 85 degrees and raining outside. So I don’t know what that’s about.

Brie Tucker (02:19)

And I think with us, all like, what are we supposed to do with that? What is this stuff coming from the sky? I don’t know

JoAnn Crohn (02:26)

I used to live in LA and I remember every time it rained, everyone forgot how to drive. There’d be so many accidents and it’d be insane on the road. Crazy. Katherine, I was digging into a little bit about you today and listening to other podcast interviews you did and something you said stuck with me because you’re an oldest child and I’m an older child too. And you describe being an older child as you want the control and also like how it kind of affects the parenting of your children. And I was wondering in this, do you as an older child have the sympathy for your oldest, but then also see what your younger children now have to deal with in terms of like the sibling dynamics? Because that’s something like I’ve seen in my parenting.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (03:13)

Yeah, I mean, I liked when you said that you like want the control, but like you have the control as the oldest. So it’s not like, I mean, you want it and also you have it because you’re the oldest. So I’m what’s, guess, seems to be a unique oldest child because I truly love being the oldest. I know that recently, I think in like the past two years, there have been all of these articles that like everyone has sent me about people writing all these articles that do deep dives into the plight of the oldest child, how terrible it is to be the oldest, all the responsibility. It’s so bad. It’s just so much pressure to put on a kid and like, you know, they have so much responsibility, blah, blah, blah. And I read every single one. I was like, but I love that. I’ve loved my role as the oldest child in my family and I’ve loved

JoAnn Crohn (03:51)

Oldest daughter syndrome.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (04:08)

it from the beginning. I’ve loved it as a child. I’ve loved it as an adult. I always loved organizing my siblings. I still do it now as a 35 year old. I love being the responsible one. I love organizing things. I love setting things up. like being like, you know, watching my mom for ⁓ guidance with everything and then reinstalling like all of her rules and like making sure that they’re doing exactly what they’re supposed to do. Like I loved that growing up. I still love it. And my oldest daughter, Lila is to the T, a typical oldest child. Oh, yeah. Is every single thing those articles talk about of like an oldest child having or characteristic or a trait or whatever.

she has it and she acts exactly the way that I acted growing up and she is a similar age difference to my second daughter Eloise that my sister and I are and then it’s the same age difference from to my next who’s my son Ford that we are to Patrick, my first brother. And so the age dynamic between my three kids is pretty much the same as the first three in my family and

The similarities between the three of them already are like, fascinating. ⁓

JoAnn Crohn (05:30)

It’s interesting because we are talking about this. We have a balanced community and I was live in the community this morning and we’re talking about whether these ways we are, such as like being the oldest child, how you like the control, you like the organization. We’re specifically talking about kind of like this negative self-talk that some of us like to give ourselves, not like to, but we tend to.

Brie Tucker (05:51)

Some of us tend to, yeah.

JoAnn Crohn (05:53)

And whether the way we are is passed down from our parents or is like more genetic. And I was wondering, is your mom also an oldest child?

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (06:04)

No, she’s the second. She has an older brother and then three younger brothers, so there’s five in her family, but she’s one of four boys.

JoAnn Crohn (06:13)

She has the oldest daughter. ⁓

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (06:14)

This is the oldest daughter. Yeah, she’s the oldest and only daughter in her family, but she’s not the oldest child.

Brie Tucker (06:19)

I have to come speak up here for the babies. I’m the baby of my family and I am turning 46 in a couple of weeks and I am still the baby. I’m still the baby. Like you said, how you like to still kind of help wrangle in your siblings. My two older sisters, they unintentionally play the big sister card with me constantly. So I’m just here to tell you all that also I would believe too, because of the fact that I am the baby and my mom was not the baby, neither was my dad. I fit the youngest sibling to a T. So I think that’s definitely just it’s who I am. At 46, my family still doesn’t expect me to bring anything to Thanksgiving except for cups and papers and napkins and plates. Like that is it.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (07:06)

That’s OK. That’s like, you know.

Brie Tucker (07:08)

I kind of like it. I get to coast. So I appreciate all the work my sister carries for me.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (07:14)

Yeah, exactly. mean, my youngest brother, Christopher, is definitely the best one in our whole family. And he’s the chillest, calmest, anyone who’s like, ⁓ I’m so excited to meet your younger brother, whatever. I’m like, he’s the best one out of all of us. Like, he’s just like, I mean, he’s the best human being. Him and I are eight years apart. But he’s very much like in my mind, still my baby. Like I was eight years older, so like I had his diaper bag packed, I had his outfits laid out. My husband’s always like, you gotta let him, because he has an amazing girlfriend now he’s like, you gotta hand that over to the girlfriend. You can do it together, it’s fine. But my husband’s the youngest in his family. So I always think it’s interesting when like an oldest marries a youngest. ⁓

Brie Tucker (08:03)

I have my husband is the oldest of five and I’m the youngest of three. Yeah. It is very interesting. That dynamic for sure.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (08:11)

Yeah,

⁓ it’s helpful.

JoAnn Crohn (08:13)

Yeah, my husband and I are two oldest. So we both like to be in charge and in control. He lets me do most of the things. He’s just along for the ride. I’m the adventure one. Something that’s really cool in your dynamic with your siblings, Katherine, is that you have this like care with each other. You don’t have this competition with each other. And that is something that is definitely like passed down through generations, because I look at you talking about your younger brother being eight years younger than you are. I have a younger sister who’s seven years younger and all attempts I have made to take care of her like that, she is like pushed away. All of these things. So just looking at the sibling dynamics, I used to be very, very in competition with my younger sister because both of my parents, my mom was a baby, my dad was an only, and they would always tell me as the oldest.

You have to set the example. You have to like do all the things without any real. You did that. Yeah, they did that too. Do you feel like that installed a sense of like sense of kind of responsibility in you or did do you feel any pressure from that?

.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (09:25)

I didn’t feel pressure from it. felt like it was a big responsibility for sure. But it also, it’s funny because I think people often ask me, do you feel pressure to do certain things coming from your family? Do you feel pressure from your parents? Do you feel pressure with your family legacy or your name and everything? And I think you can look at it two different ways. Like you feel pressure in a negative way or you feel responsibility to do great things and I really gravitated towards, okay, I’m the oldest, so I have the responsibility to set a good example for my three younger siblings or, you know, I come from this amazing family. I’m not gonna like let it paralyze me. I’m gonna look at it and say like how inspiring all of those people are and are in my family doing amazing things. I’m gonna use that to also inspire me to do great things and make the world a better place. So I think it really, depends on your mindset with how you look at things like responsibility, because you can look at it in a negative way, or you can look at it as like, my gosh, I’m so lucky I have that responsibility. Now let me go and do something with it. Or you can look at it like, gosh, that’s so much. It’s paralyzing to me. It’s debilitating. I don’t want to do anything. So I think it really depends on the mindset and the framework around it.

JoAnn Crohn (10:50)

This is so fascinating, Katherine, because I’m seeing a difference in the mindset that you have and the mindset that I have struggled to get that mindset and I want to dig into it deeper right after this.

So right before the break, Katherine, you were talking about how you could choose to see things in a positive way or a negative way. Have you struggled in the past ever with negative self-talk and a negative mindset that you had to work your way out of?

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (11:15)

For sure. mean, I think especially as women and when you’re a young girl, definitely, or I should say I definitely growing up was somebody who would sit in front of a mirror and like pick myself apart. And I think we all at certain times in life have negative self-talk. And I think it’s all about how you can work yourself out of those moments. As I’ve gotten older, I would say that I work my way out of it like through probably what would make most people feel like uncomfortable humor. I have found that to be like very helpful for me. My sister makes me laugh like nobody can. And so her and I will sit and kind of do like negative self-talk together and then pop out of it. But I think you kind of have to figure out like what works best for you to navigate yourself out of it so you don’t sit in it. That’s to me the biggest thing. And I think I did kind of a deep dive into that when I wrote one of my books I wrote called The Gift of Forgiveness and I did like a deep dive into just the subject of forgiveness and how it’s not something that you can just like for most people that you say like, I’m going to practice forgiveness and you’re good for the rest of your life. But it’s something that is like a daily journey or a daily battle that a lot of people have setbacks for. And I always was talking to people about how when you go back to feeling anger or feeling like you can’t forgive how you work yourself out of sitting in that so you don’t just sit in that negativity or sit in that heaviness. And I think it’s really the same with like negative self-talk. It’s like, how do you acknowledge it being there? Allow yourself to feel it or experience it and then work your way out of it. And I think that’s the case for a lot of emotions. I learned a lot from my mom about that. I would say like as a young woman about negative self-talk, my mom always would have moments of having negative self-talk and then quickly snap out of it.

JoAnn Crohn (13:14)

And you would watch her do this? She made this kind of model this for you?

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (13:19)

I mean, my mom and I are super close and we’re all close in our family together. I would say my mom and my dad really taught us a huge amount by leading by example, because I think that that’s really what kids pick up on is like, you can tell them so many things, but if you like lead by example, it’s totally different. I watched my mom have moments of like having negative self-talk or even I would say my dad definitely. I don’t think I’ve ever seen him have negative self-talk. He’s always been like somebody who just is like, you got to pump yourself up and fire yourself up like nobody else can. So that was also like a great thing to witness and also a fascinating thing to witness because I’m just like, how do you never, and I’m sure in his own mind he does occasionally, but he just is like, you have to think that you are the best to get to.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (14:14)

where he’s gotten and that’s worked for him. It’s obviously easier said than done. But I think as women, it’s something that I’m very mindful of with my daughters.

Brie Tucker (14:24)

I was going to say you’ve already sold me on the gift of forgiveness. As soon as we are done, I am going on Amazon to purchase that because as all of our listeners know, I think at this point, Brie has some issues with forgiveness. I need to get through that. So I need to like be able to acknowledge that and move on.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (14:41)

Pretty much everyone does, so you’re in a good situation.

JoAnn Crohn (14:45)

Even like forgiving yourself for things that you’ve done in the past or you’ve shown up in the past. Something that I had a hard time when I entered motherhood, the overwhelm of it all, the things that I wanted to be to my kids, the amount of tasks that I saw on the table that I think I really entered that space of negative self-talk where I’m like, my gosh, there’s just so much to be done and so many things like that I’m failing at that I’m not doing. How do you navigate that overwhelm of motherhood, Katherine? How do you view it?

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (15:22)

I would say a couple things. One is I implemented last summer when I was pregnant with my third, I implemented having the practice of TM, is Transcendental Meditation. Yes.

JoAnn Crohn (15:37)

my gosh. One of our friends at the podcast, Dr. Bill Sticksrud also practices TM, Transcendental Meditation. So tell us more about that.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (15:45)

So last summer I was pregnant and my two daughters, we were somewhere over the summer and I was with my mom and my sister and I was like in the chaos of the day with like my two year old and my three and a half year old and very pregnant, hot in the summer. You know, painting the whole picture

JoAnn Crohn (16:08)

It’s a lot a lot of physical stress right there

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (16:11)

Yeah, one evening I was like getting them bathed in their pajamas and you know, doing the whole thing and just like kind of tapped out and I was sitting downstairs with my mom and my sister and my sister was like, it was like almost like they had an intervention with me but they were like, you know, you have known since you were born that you wanted to be a mom. You have always looked forward to which is true because everybody always made fun of me when I was growing up. They’re like, you’re 40 years old when I was like in high school because I was like, I don’t vibe with all of this. Like in college, I went out like a total of maybe five or six times my whole college experience. I just did not. Yeah. I didn’t vibe with it at all. I always felt way older than I was. I was like very interested in going to bed early and waking up early and still having responsibility.

Brie Tucker (17:00)

Brie was hiding in the bushes from the cops at a gauger on the first day of College

Brie Tucker (17:06)

Babies have no worries. We know it’s all gonna work out so

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (17:10)

Yeah, I know. So I was just like in the kind of craziness of like the day and my sister was like, you’ve known you want to be a mom for so long and like you have this beautiful family and you know, you’re having another baby and like you don’t seem right now that you’re really enjoying the present moment and you don’t seem like you’re having fun. It’s something really only a sister can say to you because I was like, excuse me. Yeah.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (17:36)

You just don’t seem like you’re enjoying this and it’s like you have so much to enjoy. And I was like, okay, you’re right. I need to implement something in my daily practice that allows me to be mothering and also just showing up in the different roles that I’m lucky enough to be in in life in a positive and also calm way. So I’m not as reactive because I would have like a temper tantrum here, a temper tantrum from my kids. And I would then like, react and I’m like, wait a second, they’re not calming down. know, you know, I’ve read a lot about kids and co-regulation and how important it is as the parent to be calm and allow them, they regulate based off of you. And so I started doing TM and it’s been incredible for me and allowed me to really regulate in a totally different way and show up to the role of mother and wife and daughter and friend and author and like, so many different roles in a very calm way. And so I think that that’s probably like one of the most important things for me to not sit in the overwhelm. I have days where I’m like, I don’t know how I’m to get all of this done for sure. I try to have a sense of humor about it. And it also helps that when I vent to my husband about it, he also has a sense of humor about it. And at the same time is really amazing at acknowledging the mother load.

Yeah. That we have. I feel like a lot of it sometimes, at least for me, is all of the chaos of getting all this stuff done and being like, my God, I have so much to do or so much that I’ve been doing already. And then just having someone like your partner, whoever it is, acknowledge all of it. Yeah. It’s big. Yeah. It’s like, okay, I can keep doing this. That helps me with when Chris says to me, like, you’re doing such a great job.

you’re gonna get it done, whatever you don’t get done, it’s okay. How can I help you? so that to me is like, know that I’m really lucky to have that. And there are plenty of days also where I call on my mom and sister. Like I live on the same street as my mom. So I’m like, mom, the girls are coming over. And my brothers also help out. like, they play with the kids all the time. Or I’ll call my dad and I’ll be like, I’m sending my kids over with auntie. I call her auntie, but my sister.

So I’m really lucky that I have family to lean on in that way, but I get overwhelmed all the time. I just try to practice some deep.

JoAnn Crohn (20:06)

And that’s amazing that your sister called you out like that and that you guys have the relationship where you like trusted her and you’re like, I need to make a change in my life to do something. It is really inspiring to hear. It also motivates me kind of to hold the people in my life to that standard too, like seeing the stress and how you had the stress and you took actions to alleviate your own stress instead of thinking that it’s beyond your control. I think that’s a really cool lesson to take from it too. We’re going to talk about your writing and especially the new book you have coming out today. So we’ll do that right after this.

So, Katherine, you have so much that you’re doing in your life, including your writing. Your new book, Kat and Brandy, is about a personal story in your life with your horse. And I was wondering, like, as reading the book, it’s about Kat, and I’m assuming that it’s all the events in the book are pretty much aligned with your life and your experience.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (21:08)

A lot of them are. mean, the relationship that is in the book between Kat and her pony Brandy is definitely based off of my best friend growing up that happened to be a horse. And so it’s definitely based off of that. But really for me, I took a lot of moments and inspiration from my own experience growing up and overcoming fears and being scared of something and really working my way through that through having the healing power of animals present in my life. And this book is really to shine a light on the healing power of animals, whatever animal it is. It can be a rabbit, a fish, a dog, a Kat, a horse. It can be whatever that is for you. But really how beneficial that is for us at all phases of life and how much I feel lucky to have been in the presence of animals to help me work through my fears.

And this is really a story about courage, about bravery, about a young girl really working through her fear to be brave and to try something new and also shining a light on the power of a shared experience between a mother and a daughter. Yeah, so a lot of it I took from my real life and then some of it is storytelling.

JoAnn Crohn (22:27)

Well it’s excellent storytelling because as I mentioned to you before the interview, I cried at the end.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (22:32)

You know, that’s so sweet. That makes me so happy. And also, I’m sorry you cried, but I’m really happy that it had that impact on you because a lot of the time I reflect on, I think anybody who has had an experience with an animal, it’s like this unspoken bond that animals don’t care what you look like. They don’t care what you do for your work. They don’t care how much money you make or what you’ve done that day that you think is so great. Animals really

love you and pay attention to you for just who you are. And you can’t fake it with an animal. And so I think what I’m sure also made you emotional about the book is just like, if you yourself have been blessed to have that experience with an animal or have that gift be in your life, it’s an emotional one for sure. Because I often am like, we’re so lucky to be in the presence of these creatures that just like love us for who we are and calm us down and give us this sense of peace that we really can’t get anywhere else. And also being able to do that as you’re young and learning about yourself and like how you work through your fears and how you show up to certain things or tap into your inner bravery or courage. It’s an emotional thing for sure.

JoAnn Crohn (23:49)

It is an emotional thing. And I think what I identified with it is like my current dog is a rescue who there’s a parallel in your story where the horse Brandy, she definitely had something happen to her with the big scar on her face. And where you mentioned it had helps you with your bravery. There was a situation when we first got my dog where she would be so, I guess, like stimulated or reactive that she would attack my other dog.

And there were these situations where we had to break up fights. It showed me a resolve that I didn’t even know I had of how I could deal with a traumatic thing in my house where two animals I loved were being hurt and then come out the other side of it. So I totally agree that animals can show you a bravery that you never knew you had. I’m curious, Kat and brandy story, like Kat manages to win over the horse.

Was that in your real life or was that a storytelling element?

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (24:48)

That was definitely real. I first met Brandy totally by coincidence at the barn one day. She was there, had nothing to do with me at all. And I saw the scar on her face and of course was like interested and curious about like what happened there. How did that happen? It didn’t really come with like a lot of backstory about what had happened. What I was told, you know, she’s not the friendliest pony. She’s really head shy. She doesn’t let anybody touch her head.

She is very skittish and normally you kind of as like a kid be like, okay, we don’t need to go there. But of course I was like, tell me more. Yeah.

Brie Tucker (25:24)

Right?

JoAnn Crohn (25:26)

So it would be like there is a challenge right there.

Brie Tucker (25:28)

And I would be like, there is a story I want to hear.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (25:31)

Yeah, it was more like there’s a story there that I wanted to learn more about which probably comes from just like watching my mom interview literally every single person that we come in contact with she’s just like the most curious person ever so I had some interactions with her and kept being told if you want to Compete in horseback riding and you want to show horses. This is not the pony for you because she’s not gonna be considered to be beautiful to look at and she’s really like head shy and she’s just not this is not where you want to plant your time and energy and I was like this is exactly where I want to plant my time and energy. So I spent a ton of time just like trying to spend time with her and get her to trust me and then also have me trust her so I could ride her and learn to ride on her and

Brie Tucker (26:07)

That’s so heartbreaking, yeah.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (26:25)

It took a lot of time, took a lot of practice, but after a lot of that just being present with each other, she let me touch her whole face. She let me ⁓ brush her face, just like everything that I had been told would never be able to happen with her. And that gave me a huge amount of confidence at a very young age for sure. And also, now that I’m older and I know lot about equine therapy and animal therapy, it’s like I gave myself a course in equine therapy.

Brie Tucker (26:58)

Okay, I just had to like throw that in there because my nephew has struggled with mental health his whole life and like he animals have been amazing. Yeah, they’re beautiful. Yeah. And we joke that my dog is a therapy dog because he just if you’re having a tough day, he just curls up right next to you. Right? They know they know and then if I see him acting more anxious or rambunctious, then I know that I’m displaying an anxious attitude, which hey, that’s Brie like what?

75 % of the time. yeah, animals, not only, like you said, do they bring this great experience in relationships and being able to care for others, but it also just really brings that calming, almost like the co-regulation that we talk about with our kids. We can learn that so well from animals. yeah.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (27:46)

For sure. mean, it’s why you have like why people have service animals or emotional support animals or and it’s also why equine therapy has been as successful as it has been. whatever the animal is, I think just being able to have that be in your life is such a huge gift and definitely gives you a sense of calm when you’re in the presence of an animal that is just like interested in picking up what your energy is and wanting it to be as possible.

JoAnn Crohn (28:17)

Yeah, well, it is a beautiful story and your book releases today. So go out and grab it wherever you get your books. Katherine, we like to end every podcast episode like this on a really high note. What is something in your life right now that you’re really excited about?

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (28:34)

I mean, this book, honestly, like I, I mean, I really feel like I’m so excited about this book coming out just to be able to talk to people about overcoming fears, how important that is to be teaching to kids at a very early age. And it’s something I always keep in mind when I’m writing a book is like, I think now in a totally different way as a mom and doing story time so much, like what are the conversations that are gonna come from families reading this book?

And I was really mindful and thought a lot about the words that I used, the storytelling in this book, and really telling it in a way where natural conversations can come up for families to have discussions about what it means to be afraid of something. How do you overcome those fears? What does it mean to have an animal or care for an animal, the responsibility that goes into that? Having a shared activity that you can do with a child or a parent and a caregiver, whatever that looks like, and also how you can take the time to work towards being brave and being courageous and overcoming those fears and having those conversations with your kids is so important. And I hope that there are natural prompts in this book to have those.

this book can really be one that is read over and over again and becomes part of people’s story time routine and bedtime routine like it has in our house. And to also be able to look at the most beautiful pictures that are in this book because Petra Brown did incredible job at that as well. So that’s what I’m excited about.

Brie Tucker (30:08)

I can tell you as an early childhood eduKator, I love that because there aren’t enough diverse stories that are easy for people to come by. just like Katherine said, if you guys are looking for something that can not only be a great story for your kids, but spark important conversations that you want to have, this is definitely a great way to do that. Kat and Brandy, I love it.

JoAnn Crohn (30:32)

Thank you, Katherine, so much for joining us today. It has really been a delight to talk with you, and you have been so giving, and it’s just a wonderful conversation. So thank you so much.

Katherine Schwarzenegger Pratt (30:41)

Thank you. Well, thank you for having me. It was so nice to talk to both of you and thank you for getting emotional about Kat and Brandy. I’m hoping everybody’s heard and got it. Thank you.

JoAnn Crohn (30:51)

Yes, yes. And for everyone out there, remember that the best mom is a happy mom. So take care of you and we’ll talk to you later.

Brie Tucker (31:00)

Thanks for stopping by.

JoAnn Crohn (31:03)

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